In January, I recommended applying for Chase Ink cards before March (see: Credit card junkies: it’s time to apply for Chase Ink). And, in February, I suggested applying for Chase co-branded cards before April (see: Chase calls an end to the game. Should we seek quick wins or long term benefits?). Both recommendations were driven by the dreaded 5/24 rule…
Chase’s 5/24 rule
In the past year or so, Chase has frequently denied applications for certain cards (such as the Sapphire Preferred and Freedom) due to having opened 5 or more credit cards (with any bank) in the past 24 months. That means that anyone who regularly signs up for credit cards in order to earn points & miles is likely to be denied when they try to sign up for these cards. Currently, the 5/24 rule does not apply to co-branded cards (e.g. it does not apply to hotel or airline cards) and it does not apply to business cards. According to Doctor of Credit, though, the 5/24 rule will be applied to business cards beginning sometime this month (as I previously reported), and to co-branded cards sometime in April 2016.
Note that the 5/24 rule doesn’t seem to be set in stone. There are plenty of reports of people getting approved for new cards despite having opened 5 or more accounts in the past 24 months. In fact, it happened recently for me: Chase Private Client and Sapphire Preferred 65K.
Pursuing 395,000 points
I don’t know whether the 5/24 rule is yet in place for Chase business cards, but yesterday I decided to take a chance and assume that it was not. I also decided that it was time to jump on a couple of decent co-branded card offers…
Marriott Rewards Premier
Yesterday morning, my wife and I each applied for the Marriott Rewards Premier card. The current offer is for 80,000 points after $3K spend plus 7,500 points for adding an authorized user. I didn’t see any point in adding each other as authorized users (since that would increase the number of new accounts that Chase sees on our reports), so we each added our teenage son. There are no minimum age requirements for authorized users.
My wife’s application was instantly approved:
Can you find the wee bit of photo editing I performed?
My application was pending. I called the recon number found on my Best Offers page and asked for an instant decision. The agent put me on hold for a few minutes and then returned to the line to ask me if it was OK if they moved some of the credit line from one of my Freedom cards to the new Marriott card. Yes, indeed. Approved!
Point tally so far: 87,500 x 2 = 175,000 after a total of $6,000 spend
Chase Ink Plus
My wife and I each already have Chase Ink Plus cards for our businesses, but I have a second business (rental property) without any current cards. So, I applied for the Chase Ink Plus card. The current offer is for 60,000 points after $5K spend.
My application is pending:
In the post “How to get approved for the Chase Ink 60K offer” I recommended not calling for an instant decision. So, with this one I’ll just wait and see what happens. If I receive a denial, I can always call then.
Point tally so far: 175,000 after a total of $6,000 spend + 60,000 pending after $5K spend
Marriott Rewards Premier Business
My wife and I both applied for the Marriott Rewards Premier Business card. The current offer for this card is for 80,000 points after $3K spend in 3 months. Both applications went pending:
For my wife, we’ll just wait and see if she gets approved. In the past this has always worked for her with Chase business applications. For me, I couldn’t wait, so I called the business reconsideration line (found here) to ask for an instant decision.
The analyst asked me a number of questions about my business and then put me on hold. When he returned to the line, he told me that the application looks good but that I would have to wait a few days for a decision. I asked him if it would simplify things if I let him move $5,000 credit line from my Ink Plus card. He said yes, that would help. After another brief hold, he returned to the line and said that my application was denied due to too many recent requests for new credit. I asked if I could appeal the decision. To my surprise, he said yes – he would take another look. A few minutes later he returned to the line and asked if I still wanted to move $5K credit line from my other business card. I said yes and then he said yes – I was approved for another 80K point offer!
End of day point tally: 255,000 after a total of $9,000 spend + 140,000 pending after $8K spend
My wife and I each applied for two Marriott credit cards: personal and business, and I applied for the Chase Ink Plus business card as well. Our Marriott personal card applications and my Marriott business card application were approved. My Ink Plus and my wife’s Marriott business card application are still pending.
If we succeed in getting approved for all 5 cards, we will earn a total of 395,000 bonus points. That’s the good news. The bad news is that we’ll have to spend $17,000 in the next 3 months to make this happen. Luckily there are still a number of good options for increasing credit card spend.
Note that, in general, Marriott points are far less valuable than Ultimate Rewards points. So, it’s not all that meaningful to add up the expected points into a single big number as I did here (395,000!). However, I do see exciting potential for using Marriott points for Travel Packages, so I am eager to pick them up while the bonus offers are so high (see: Analysis of Marriott Travel Packages: 5 Night vs. 7 Night).
There were a couple of reasons we focused entirely on Chase applications. Primarily, we wanted to get in these applications before the 5/24 rules settle in for business and co-branded cards. Secondly, by applying only for Chase cards, we’ll each incur only a single hard credit inquiry on our reports. With many banks, including Chase, multiple same day inquiries are known to be consolidated into one inquiry. For easy reference, I’ve included this information in the “App Tips” table at the top of each bank section on the Best Offers page.
[…] readers may be thinking “Greg, just last week you applied for 3 cards in one day, and now you say that it’s better to just do one at a time! What […]
[…] to get a bunch of signup bonuses before Chase’s 5/24 rule kicked in (see the original post, “Chasing 395,000 points” for details). And, by applying for multiple Chase cards in one day, I knew that the credit […]
[…] Chase cards with the hope of securing 395,000 bonus points. You can read the full details here: Chasing 395,000 points. I don’t have final results yet (still waiting!) but I do have info about application response […]
I just applied today for Marriott personal ( It went to pending )and am tempted to apply tonight for the Marriott business. Do you think applying for a second card hurts my chances of getting at least the first one or would they be looked at separately as business and personal?
I don’t think that the second application is likely to hurt the first one
Just to encourage folks to call recon if denied: I was approved for Ink Plus after waiting about a week, but denied for IHG, which I applied for 2nd on the same day. Put off calling in for a couple weeks, but finally bit the bullet. Guy on the other end was super nice, said it was pretty standard for the computer to automatically reject more than one app in a day. Put me on hold for a few and then came on asking if I was willing to move some credit around. Didn’t grill me at all and was super pleasant to deal with! Glad I called in, as I’m not likely to be getting any more Chase cards for a while, if the 5/24 rule hits all their cards. (I had opened more than 5 new cards in the last 4 months, not to mention what I’ve done in the last two years.) Credit score around 730 or so and declared income less than $40k…
[…] with the good news that Frequent Miler shared yesterday, I think it is safe to say that people who apply for a lot of credit cards can still be approved […]
I’ve been playing “the game” for about 5 years. Hubby has about 20 open cards. I have closer to 25. We both have excellent credit ratings, income, 2 legitimate businesses, etc. Hubby got denied for a CSP a couple of weeks ago. The wouldn’t take any credit limit from any of his other cards – just a flat out “No.” 5/24 rule.
I got denied then approved for a Southwest Plus card after swapping it for my Southwest Premier. They wouldn’t give me the business card though. My United biz card annual fee just posted. I’m thinking of trying again for the Southwest biz card and asking them to swap it.
I got Ink Plus targeted apps in the mail four months in a row. I mailed one in last week just to see if they really mean it. I already have an Ink Bold and converted 2 old Ink Plus cards to Ink Cash cards last year. I’d happily change a Cash to Plus for 50,000 URs. We’ll see what happens.
Good luck with the Ink Plus apps. Please let us know how that turns out.
I had an Ink Bold and applied for an Ink Plus hoping to offer to swap if denied- but it was approved. So now I have both!
do you think it’s wise to apply for Ink cash and United biz cards with just SSN on the same day? those are the only two cards that interest me atm and obviously time is running out.
someone above said they got banned by chase for too many apps on one day… i definitely do not ant to get banned.
The comments here was the first I’ve heard of people getting shut down from Chase for applying for too many cards. I don’t have any way of estimating the risk. If you’re worried, then just pick one of the two. You could do the Ink Cash now, wait a month, then do United.
Many data points showed that Chase can be reluctant to approve more than 2 cards within 30 days.
Greg, were you aware of these reports and what’s your thought about them?
I’m aware that’s true with personal cards, but I don’t know if it’s true for business cards.
[I posted this elsewhere earlier today, but realized it’s more relevant here since it is about Chase sign up bonuses]
I’m relatively new to this and I have a quick sign-up strategy question for you. Earlier this week I was denied a Chase Freedom application (5/24 I’m sure). I am getting married soon, so in the last year I’ve applied for, and received, both Citi TY cards, SPG personal, Citi Hilton Reserve, Chase Ink, and CSP (2 weeks ago and I have met minimum spend already because I am paying for a wedding). Thanks largely to your help and advice – I’ve accumulated a lot of points which will make for a great honeymoon, but there are a few more cards I’d like to take things over the top.
They are: Chase Hyatt, AmEx Hilton Surpass (for points + AxOn awards), and SPG business (to take advantage of the current great offer). The AmEx Hilton is most critical from a honeymoon standpoint, but they’d all be helpful. My question is – what order should I apply and when? I’m worried more cards would make it difficult to get approved for the Hyatt card, but I was also denied on an application from Chase earlier this week. So I don’t know if I should wait or start with this one? Plus as you know – the bonuses on the two AmEx cards won’t be around forever. It’s also possible I am over thinking this, and it doesn’t matter what order I apply. Thanks in advance.
Amex is usually pretty lax on approvals. I have gotten 6 in the last 12-18 months so I would go with the Chase first and would wait or week or two to do it…just my opinion though.
I am a moron, and copied another post to start, meaning I got your name wrong. I am sorry Greg.
I agree with Mark O, your best chance is to start with Chase. If possible, try to time the Hyatt card app so that it is at least a month after the failed Freedom app. On the day you apply, you can call recon to try to push through an approval. If successful, then you can apply for one of the Amex credit cards on that same day. I think you could get away with doing the SPG card and then wait 8 days or so before doing the Hilton card.
I’m taking this challenge too, to earn a vacation package with Marriott. My wife and I applied for the Marriott Personal and Business cards on Feb 28 and I was instantly approved for the business card. My wife’s biz card and both of our personal cards went pending. I called today to ask about my personal application and was quizzed about having opened several credit card accounts in the recent past. After answering these questions, I was put on hold and told after the rep came back that it’d still be a few days for a decision. I asked if he wanted to move $12k from my IHG card and he said that would help and if they approved the Marriott card they’d make the transfer of credit line. That call took 30 minutes. After I hung up, I called back an hour later and spoke to another rep that looked at the application and after putting me on hold for about 8 minutes, came back and said I was approved. I’ll have to wait to hear about my wife’s applications, as she refuses to call them. 😉
Nice! Its funny how different analysts respond to the same applications so differently. Clearly application approvals are more an art than a science.
My husband applied for the CSP and Ink Business Cards. He has only the two Southwest cards. And, has had them about a year. He has a legitimate business, income is good, credit rating to excellent. Received instant approval for the CSP, but was denied the Ink card via letter about a week later. Should we call and recon and and offer to give up the SW business card or to move some credit? He really does need the Ink to separate his business expenses.
Worth a try…if he has the SW biz card he may be able to make it work by shutting it down to free up the CL….already got denied so all they can say is no again.
Yes, there’s no harm in calling. Try calling more than once if the first person says no.
Wait a minute, if you are a Chase Private Client, why are you applying through the web site like the rest of us nobodys? Don’t you get a special entry?
The only enhanced offer for Private Clients that I’m aware of right now is with the Sapphire Preferred card.
Correct. I recently applied for an Ink Plus via Private Client, but the offer was identical to the targeted offer mailed to me which has the annual fee waived the first year.
Any bonus points to apply business card if being CPC?
Ozzie, no, I don’t believe that the business card offers are enhanced for Chase Private Client
Thanks for the quick answer. Yes this past weekend I was able to confirm with the banker that CSP is the only card with bonus points with CPC program. However it seems you can break 5/24 rule if being Private Client.
He can apply through his links and earn a commission for getting the cards 🙂
Are you not including the points earned via the spend?
80000 after $3000 spend would be at least 83000 points.
+7500 for AU, that’s 90500.
I know 6000 Marriott points between the two of you isn’t a ton, but it’s a point-saver category 1 night.
I didn’t include points from spend because I was focused on the signup bonus itself, but yes I could have shown bigger numbers by including those points.
Applied for the Chase Sapphire on Sunday night and got a pending decision. Called but of course they were closed. Tried again Monday morning and they had already decisioned it as a decline and sent out at letter. Thought I was under the 5/24 rule but didn’t catch a business application that stayed on my credit bureau.
I suppose short of calling in and trying to reapply over the phone, there is no hope in getting the card anytime soon?
You can try calling the reconsideration line a few more times for the same application. Surprisingly, its not unusual for one agent to deny an app, but another agent approves it.
Interesting, I will give that a try. The first agent made it sound like it was decisioned and there was no looking back. Thanks!
Can you have both – Mariott and Ritz Carlton? I recently applied and received RC, would it make sense to apply for Mariott as well (since the points between those two hotels can be used interchangeably)?
Yes I believe you can have both.
When was your application for your other Ink Card? Was it within the past 24 months? I am trying to determine if you can get the Ink sign up bonus more than once within the 24 month window.
My old Ink Plus is from 2013. I don’t know if they apply the 24 month rule to Ink card apps
Thank you. I am contemplating applying for another Ink Plus with a different business before they change the 5/24 rules this month. My first Ink application was in Jan 2016. Is it worth giving that a shot (I have referred myself so 70k UR points total), or should I not risk it if I can just apply for the United Business card (50k UA)?
I think its worth a shot especially if you have a legitimate 2nd business with a different EIN
As of a month ago there was no 24 month language for the Ink Plus. I checked before applying and got approved 20 or so months after getting my first bonus for the same business.
There have been reports of people getting shut down lately for applying for multiple chase cards on the same day. Something to keep in mind…
Interesting – where did you read that? Can you link to it by any chance…was thinking of going for 2 later this month!
My close friend was shutdown by Chase about 2 years ago for 3 credit card applications within 30 days (two same day + one later). At that time his credit history was short about 3 years. Interesting thing is that cards were approved and shortly thereafter the security dept (or something like that) came and closed all accounts including bank checking accounts.
I personally have had no problem with applying 2 chase cards on the same day, sometimes every 6 months over period of last 4 years. My credit history is 20 years.
3 applications in one day with the same bank usually ends in at least one denial as we see in FM’s post. It is unusual to appeal a denial (on a 3rd app of the day no less) and get approved. It is rare. FYI
There were a couple threads on the r/churning subreddit. I remember seeing two cases where people applied for multiple personal cards on the same day trying to get ahead of the new rule implementation, and were subsequently shut down.
If I apply for a business card using the business’ EIN and u have never applied for a card for this business, does Chase count it as the first application?
Or, does chase count the personal applications I have made and applications for other businesses?
Chase counts all of them: personal and business. It doesn’t matter if you use an EIN